Glenn Campbell - devoted many years to the investigation of UFOs, especially relating to Area 51.

- Glenn Campbell discusses Bob Lazar and UFOs.

For many years Glen Campbell devoted his life to the study of UFOs and was acknowledged as the “expert” on all things relating to Area 51.

By Glenn Campbell

I am happily retired from the Area 51 field and am currently enjoying a blissfully UFO-free lifestyle, but one issue won't leave me alone: People keep asking me about Bob Lazar. True or False: Did he work with flying saucers at "Area S-4"?

I adore ambiguity, and I really hate being pinned down like this. I mean, what is truth anyway? My idle-handed colleagues and I have been researching Lazar's claims since 1992, but I wasn't there when Lazar first made those claims, and no one can visit the secure military areas where Lazar's experiences supposedly took place. Who am I to declare what is and is not reality?

Still the inquiries keep coming, especially after Lazar's recent reappearance on Art Bell (June 6, 2002), where he announced yet another movie deal. The only way to efficiently deal with my questioners is to come up with a crude one-word answer.

Unfortunately, that answer is False.

I don't mean this as an insult to Mr. Lazar. He's an incredibly creative and intelligent guy. I also don't mean to denigrate Lazar's many supporters. One thing I learned while studying Area 51 is that you don't mess with people's religion. Lazar, I believe, has a right to make his claims, and people have a right to believe him. Lazar's flying saucers have become part of Nevada's identity, and probably even my own. I mean "False" only in a rather mundane factual sense.

Lazar did not work with flying saucers in an underground hangar near Papoose Lake. He made the story up. Furthermore, he made it up by himself, without the help of any nefarious agency and probably without any deep motivation other than the pleasure of attracting attention and putting people on.

The story evolved out of a long heritage of pre-existing underground alien base claims, which eventually infected the pilot and conspiracy theorist John Lear. Lear announced, in electronic bulletin board posts in the 1980s, that gray aliens were eating humans in deep underground facilities at Area 51. Lazar met Lear, heard his ramblings, and decided to give Lear what he wanted. Lazar took Lear's paranoid delusions and repackaged them in a much more intelligent and internally consistent rendition. Initially, Lear was the only audience, but he tipped off a Las Vegas TV station, and the frenzy began. The story soon spun out of Lazar's control, and, at least until the recent Art Bell appearance, Lazar seemed to sincerely want it to go away.

Lazar's limited knowledge of Area 51 came from secondhand sources, which are plentiful in Las Vegas. Lazar has never been to Area 51. His "S-4" is a relocated and reconfigured version of "Site 4", a real Top Secret radar testing facility west of Area 51. Lazar's saucers and their propulsion system seem plausible to anyone without a physics degree. They were constructed, in Lazar's head, with the same fastidious care that he has lavished on his real-life fireworks, jet cars and other mechanical projects. "Element 115" and its peculiar periodic neighbors were discussed in an article in Scientific American just before Lazar used it to fuel his craft. Lazar has always displayed an exceptional respect for detail and consistency, and he has an extraordinary ability to focus his attention on whatever his current project is, to the exclusion of everything else. His only deficiencies are moral (that is, if you consider lies and the exploitation of others to be somehow 'wrong').

A good model for how Lazar operates is found in the forger Mark Hoffman, now in prison for murder.

While forging Mormon documents, Hoffman built a detailed web of lies that still leaves researchers in awe. Hoffman's forgeries were internally consistent and perfect in every detail, and they meshed seamlessly with the world of existing documents, many of which he also created. His trance-like ability to focus his attention was so highly developed that he easily fooled polygraph tests.

Lazar is in the same league, having convinced a hypnotherapist of his truthfulness and earned at least an "inconclusive" polygraph report. Lazar might be even more clever than Hoffman, because he hasn't significantly broken the law, and he strictly limits his claims to his original story.

You can ask me for proof for my Lazar position, but I'm not going to play the game anymore. The Lazar documentation on the internet is already massive, and the heated debates about one detail or another of Lazar's claims have been going on for over a decade. It is senseless to harp on his false educational credentials, enhanced employment claims or pandering conviction.

Those who believe in Lazar are going to continue believing, and those who don't will only say, "I told you so." The funny thing about oral traditions like this is that they continue to live and propagate regardless of the evidence and far beyond their original source. They spawn new stories, like the similar UFO claims of Bill Uhouse, aka "Jarod 2" (which is another fascinating personal journey). Lazar's story has grown much bigger than Lazar himself, and no one will ever be able to follow all of its threads.

Answering "False" still rubs me the wrong way. I distain finality, and I certainly don't want to attract the attention Lazar's rabid supporters. Instead, I would rather state things in relative terms: Lazar's claims _could_ be true, like the boy crying wolf who eventually encounters a real one, but given the known lies and lack of new information, the joy of exploring the story has dwindled. Life is full of more interesting mysteries.

Glenn Campbell

June 2002

The following article was published by “Raiders News Service” on 12th May, 2005  

Have Scientists Just Proven Bob Lazar Right On Alien Antigravity systems?

       
By Thomas Horn
Senior RNU News Reporter

The article went on to quote Peter King, physics professor at Nottingham University, as saying, "We can take an object and float it in mid-air because the magnetic forces on the object are enough to balance gravity."

The device evidently exploits diamagnetism by placing non-magnetic objects inside a strong magnetic field where they are forced to act like weak magnets themselves. A field is created that is stronger below and weaker above. The resulting upward magnetic force cancels out gravity.

To make the anti gravity machine even more powerful, the team used an oxygen and nitrogen mixture to create a paramagnetic fluid. Inside the magnet, the mixture helps the objects float. US space agency Nasa notified the team that it is interested in their zero gravity research. UFO buffs may recall a man named Bob Lazar [left] discussing a similar antigravity propulsion system over a decade ago, one that he said came from aliens. Lazar claimed to have worked as a physicist on a highly classified government project, called Galileo, which involved back engineering of alien technology. The research supposedly took place at a hidden base known only as S4, a few miles south of Area 51. At the time, Lazar said he and others were working on extraterrestrial craft hundreds of years in advance of modern technology. He also claimed to have seen a total of nine different types of saucers as well as documents and autopsies of alien corpses. The saucer-type he professed to have worked on had a diameter of 9-12 m with a console and small, children-sized seats. He said he was told the aliens arrived in the vessel from the fourth planet of the binary stellar system Zeta Reticuli 2. In "On the Record" with investigative reporter George Knapp, September 12, 1989, Lazar said the alien craft flew by amplifying gravity waves through use of a reactor and an alien element--atomic number 115--an ore not found or synthesized on earth.

When asked to explain how the alien antigravity system worked, the program took an interesting twist:

Lazar: Inside that tower is a chip of Element 115 they just put in there. That's a super-heavy element. The lid goes on top. And as far as any other of the workings of it, I really don't know, you know, [such as] what's inside the bottom of it . . . 115 sets up a gravitational field around the top. That little wave guide you saw being put on the top: it essentially siphons off the gravity wave, and that's later amplified in the lower portion of the craft. But just in general, the whole technology is virtually unknown.

Knapp: Now we saw the model. We saw the pictures of it there. It looks really, really simple, almost too simple to actually do anything.

Lazar: Right.

Knapp: Working parts?

Lazar: None detectable. Essentially, what the job was was to back- engineer everthing, where you have a finished product and to step backwards and find out how it was made or how it could be made with earthly materials. There hasn't been very much progress.

Knapp: How long do you think they've had this technology up there?

Lazar: It seems like quite a while, but I really don't know.

Knapp: What could you do with an anti-matter generator? What does it do?

Lazar: It converts anti-matter . . . It doesn't convert anti-matter! There's an annihilation reaction. It's an extremely powerful reaction, a hundred percent conversion of matter to energy, unlike a fission or fusion reaction which is somewhere around eight-tenths of one percent conversion of matter to energy.

Knapp: How does it work? What starts the reaction going?

Lazar: Really, once the 115 is put in, the reaction is initiated.

Knapp: Automatic.

Lazar: Right.

Knapp: I don't understand. I mean, there's no button to push or anything?

Lazar: No, there's no button to push or anything. Apparently, the 115 under bombardment with protons lets out an anti-matter particle. This anti-matter particle will react with any matter whatsoever, which I imagine there is some target system inside the reactor. This, in turn, releases heat, and somewhere within that system there is a one-hundred-percent- efficient thermionic generator, essentially a heat-to-electrical generator.

Knapp: How is this anti-matter reactor connected to gravity generation that you were talking about earlier?

Lazar: Well, that reactor serves two purposes; it provides a tremendous amount of electrical power, which is almost a by-product. The gravitational wave gets formed at the sphere, and that's through some action of the 115, and the exact action I don't think anyone really knows. The wave guide siphons off that gravity wave, and that's channeled above the top of the disk to the lower part where there are three gravity amplifiers, which amplify and direct that gravity wave.

Knapp: In essence creating their own gravitational field.

Lazar: Their own gravitational field.

Knapp: You're fairly convinced that science on earth doesn't have this technology right now? We have it now at S-4, I guess, but we didn't create it?

Lazar: Right.

Knapp: Why not? Why couldn't we?

Lazar: The technology's not even-we don't even know what gravity is!

Knapp: Well, what is it? What have you learned about what gravity is?

Lazar: Gravity is a wave. There are many different theories, wave included. It's been theorized that gravity is also particles, gravitons, which is also incorrect. But gravity is a wave. The basic wave they can actually tap off of an element: why that is I' m not exactly sure.

Knapp: So you can produce your own gravity. What does that mean? What does that allow you to do?

Lazar: It allows you to do virtually anything. Gravity distorts time and space. By doing that, now you're into a different mode of travel, where instead of traveling in a linear method going from Point A to B, now you can distort time and space to where you essentially bring the mountain to Mohammad, you almost bring your destination to you without moving. And since you're distorting time, all this takes place in between moments of time. [1]

Now, have British scientists proven Lazar was telling the truth? Have they let the alien anti-gravity-cat out of the bag? I asked nuclear physicist and renowned UFO investigator Stanton T. Friedman. Here is what he said:

The simple answer is no. One could also say a rocket was an antigravity device because its exhaust leads to it moving upward whereas gravity pulls it down. A pulley arrangement for lifting something is not an antigravity device. The use of magnetic forces as in the magnetic train (maglev) that is noted in the article is not new. It does not create a gravitational field. It does not nullify gravity. A force is exerted which is upward. Gravity is still there. There is no connection whatsoever between this sort of device and the Lazar science fiction device which is as mythical as his supposed degrees from MIT and Cal Tech and his employment as a physicist at Los Alamos. Check out my article on Lazar at my website www.stantonfriedman.com. Incidently, magnetoaerodynamic devices such as I described in my Congressional testimony in 1968 and in various papers can also exert upward forces... but are not anti-gravity. It is also true that 4 atoms of Element 115 were created at a huge accelerator in Dubna. Half life was in the millisecond range. Lazar claimed at one time that Los Alamos had 500 pounds. No way Jose. Half life is too short. Stan Friedman

I also decided to ask scientist Stan Deyo about the subject. Stan has held Above Top Secret Security Clearance, worked undercover for the FBI, and was part of an exclusive "black project" headed by Dr. Edward Teller specializing in the development of "flying saucer technology". Here's what Stan said:

Hi, Tom, Stanton and I concur about Bob and his mythical tale about his involvement in the Area 51 program. Furthermore, I agree with Stanton on the erroneous assertion in the article above. Using two magnets to levitate masses with low magnetic permeability is not "antigravity" in the strictest sense. It is magnetic levitation - not something altering the gravitational field. I find Bob's story about his history being erased by the government hard to believe. According to him, even his high school record was erased.... Does that mean all the kids who went to school with him had Bob's photo removed from their personal copies of their high school annual books? Does that mean all Bob's fellow students and his teachers in ALL those schools and universities he allegedly attended found him so unremarkable that they cannot remember him in school with them? I don't know why Bob apparently fabricated so much of his story.... It just muddied the water for those trying to ferret the truth of the suppressed technologies and alien presences on our world. It is true that electricity can be produced by thermionic conversion within a small bandwidth of infrared radiation by allowing it to fall upon a tribo-luminescent stratum which, itself, forms part of a tuned, resonant-cavity circuit.... I am pretty certain that T. Henry Moray (and possibly Harry E. Perrigo) made primitive forms of this circuit. Element 115 is not necessary to supply the thermal energy in a thermionic conversion process. I will be presenting a talk in Roswell this year at the third "Ancient of Days" conference. There, I will present my thoughts on the emerging concept of "gravity" being a vector sum between divergent and convergent spinning waves around the center of spin of a mass. I will address the issue of why gravity appears to be such a weak force when in reality gravity is the resultant of much larger div/con wave vectors. Hope this helps clear the water a bit.... Stan

Following Stan's comments, I think I see a sequel to this article in the not too distant future. The headline might read something like: Have Scientists Just Proven Stan Deyo Right on Alien Antigravity Systems